How to make a proper ladder.

[Credge]

This is for any map maker is happening to find their ladders incredibly hard to use. It essentially makes any hard to use ladder incredibly easy to use.

First, lay down your ladder prop/texture. Then, create a ladder block over the prop/texture. Make sure that the prop is a good deal bigger than your prop/texture. I use increments of 16 in the below picture.



Then, take your clipping tool and cut, like so.



Finally, delete the remaining bits (or you may not need to depending on what clipping mode you are in).



The less steep the angle, the better... so smaller increments of measure are generally the best. Of course, you want a front flat edge that is about the same size as your ladder prop/texture. It doesn't have to be though.

Anyway, what this does is allow players to jump at the ladder from any angle and pass from one side of the ladder to another. I recommend every map maker to do this as it makes ladders in FF reliable and easy to use. No more unlucky jumps, no more replacing ladders with push entities... just sweet, reliable, ladders.

[GeoKill----->]

I agree with this type of ladder, it just feels so smooth.

[GambiT]

i completely disagree with that way of doing it, but to each his own.

i don't seem to have a picture of it in my photo album to show(thought i did)

basically, i turn off all collision on the ladder, and i make a brush 2 units thick running straight down the middle of the ladder(the width of the ladder). call me old fashioned but to go up a ladder you have to be in front of it do you not? i dont like it when ppl fly up a ladder way off to the side of it, but thats just me.

looking at your picture, see the "steps" in the middle? thats basically what i build my brush to fit.

[Firefox11]

Originally Posted by GambiT

i completely disagree with that way of doing it, but to each his own.

i don't seem to have a picture of it in my photo album to show(thought i did)

basically, i turn off all collision on the ladder, and i make a brush 2 units thick running straight down the middle of the ladder(the width of the ladder). call me old fashioned but to go up a ladder you have to be in front of it do you not? i dont like it when ppl fly up a ladder way off to the side of it, but thats just me.

looking at your picture, see the "steps" in the middle? thats basically what i build my brush to fit.

That's how I did the ladders in the map I'm working on =o

IIRC, that's how the Valve Wiki tells you to make them, more or less. Sure it's frustrating when you can't reach the top because you are climbing the side, but it feels more realistic (lol realism in FF?!). But everyone has his tastes, right? =D

[Credge]

Originally Posted by GambiT

i completely disagree with that way of doing it, but to each his own.

i don't seem to have a picture of it in my photo album to show(thought i did)

basically, i turn off all collision on the ladder, and i make a brush 2 units thick running straight down the middle of the ladder(the width of the ladder). call me old fashioned but to go up a ladder you have to be in front of it do you not? i dont like it when ppl fly up a ladder way off to the side of it, but thats just me.

looking at your picture, see the "steps" in the middle? thats basically what i build my brush to fit.

The problem with this, as is currently present in monkey, is that you can jump right at it and because of the orientation of your player (turned slightly left or right) you may not grab it, or you may grab the side instead.

Realism, especially in TF games, should always takes a back seat to playability. Going up a ladder and finding out that going up the side of it doesn't allow you to get up is poor. The thing is, though, that it's not realistic to be able to climb up one side of a ladder and not transition from the side of it to the front. Anyone can do that.

[fishBurger]

shutdown 2 flagroom ladders need this.

[Skanky Butterpuss]

Originally Posted by fishBurger

shutdown 2 flagroom ladders need this.

indeed

im pushing for all of the official maps to have ladders like this. elmo asked for a list of those maps that need it, and i forgot to give it to him. i should get on that.

[GambiT]

rock2 will NOT have ladders like that, i'm sorry but i think the way i said i do them is the best way, even for playability. i've never had a problem going up OR down a ladder made the way i do it.

why was this thread was stickied?

[Credge]

Originally Posted by GambiT

rock2 will NOT have ladders like that, i'm sorry but i think the way i said i do them is the best way, even for playability. i've never had a problem going up OR down a ladder made the way i do it.

why was this thread was stickied?

I don't know why it was stickied.

However, many maps have major problems with ladders. SD2, monkey, and evenflow are three I can think of just off the top of my head. Pretty much every map with a reliance on a ladder has this issue. Very few maps don't need to have ladders like this, and those are generally maps where ladders don't play a pivotal part to the offense as this is, mainly, an offensive issue.

[GambiT]

ok, i understand "why" you want it like that, i guess the thing that bugs me the most about that is it being 16 units thick. i'd be fine with making mine like that but 2 units thick and maybe 4 units out on the slope or 4 and 4. if you understand what i'm saying. i just think the 16 units is a bit excessive.

i need to get on my computer at home this weekend(for the first time in weeks!!) i'll post a few SS's of the way i'm talking about so y'all have a visual of what i mean.

i'm in agreeance on one thing for sure, all of the ladders should be made close to the same way.

[Credge]

Originally Posted by GambiT

ok, i understand "why" you want it like that, i guess the thing that bugs me the most about that is it being 16 units thick. i'd be fine with making mine like that but 2 units thick and maybe 4 units out on the slope or 4 and 4. if you understand what i'm saying. i just think the 16 units is a bit excessive.

i need to get on my computer at home this weekend(for the first time in weeks!!) i'll post a few SS's of the way i'm talking about so y'all have a visual of what i mean.

i'm in agreeance on one thing for sure, all of the ladders should be made close to the same way.

Oh, the 16 units was just so it could be one unit thick and easy to see, you know, for an example. In practice it should always be smaller, like units of 2, 4, or 8.

[GambiT]

ok, sooooo, if i'm understanding right, we're in agreeance of how to make the ladder, but the image is incorrect(its just used as a visual example)??

if so then i think an image of one made smaller to give them a more accurate way of it being done might help, otherwise we're going to start seeing ppl climb up ladders 16 units away from them. lol

[GeoKill----->]

I sticky this so others can make their ladders this way