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Old 06-25-2008, 04:56 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Innoc
There is no chance in hell I'd play any MMO. It's a complete mismatch for how I play games. I spend WAY too much time outside and interact with other humans on a regular basis for MMO's.
I don't really understand this position. I played EQ rather casually for 4 years and only got to level 48 (with various other level 40 characters) out of, by that time, 80 (70?). The idea that one does not have time for an MMO is just like saying you don't have time for any game. MMO's have gone from being major time sinks (like EQ, although they most certainly did not require you to put in major time sinks) to casual things you play for, on average, 7 hours a week.

Also, interact with other humans? Eh? Maybe I simply don't understand what you mean since MMO's equate to interacting with others both willingly and unwillingly.
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Old 06-25-2008, 04:59 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Credge
I don't really understand this position. I played EQ rather casually for 4 years and only got to level 48 (with various other level 40 characters) out of, by that time, 80 (70?). The idea that one does not have time for an MMO is just like saying you don't have time for any game. MMO's have gone from being major time sinks (like EQ, although they most certainly did not require you to put in major time sinks) to casual things you play for, on average, 7 hours a week.

Also, interact with other humans? Eh? Maybe I simply don't understand what you mean since MMO's equate to interacting with others both willingly and unwillingly.
I play 10 minutes here and there. I have zero interest in ANYTHING that is subscription based as past experience shows I have WAY more interests in doing RL things than pissing my life away playing a game. The difference between online and RL interaction with others is significant. I far prefer the latter.
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Old 06-25-2008, 05:13 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Innoc
I play 10 minutes here and there. I have zero interest in ANYTHING that is subscription based as past experience shows I have WAY more interests in doing RL things than pissing my life away playing a game. The difference between online and RL interaction with others is significant. I far prefer the latter.
This is what I don't understand. You only play games 10 minutes here and there yet you're posting on a forum based on a mod for a video game. That would be like me going to a biker rally if I've only ridden on a motorcycle for a total of 25 minutes in my life.

I think you underestimate your time commitment to video games like most people do.
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Old 06-25-2008, 05:44 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Credge
This is what I don't understand. You only play games 10 minutes here and there yet you're posting on a forum based on a mod for a video game. That would be like me going to a biker rally if I've only ridden on a motorcycle for a total of 25 minutes in my life.

I think you underestimate your time commitment to video games like most people do.
Most of my gaming anymore is on my DS. It's sporadic and secondary to all other activities in my life. Fact of the matter is that subscription-based gaming would be a waste for me. Also, your analogy doesn't even come close to fitting me. I have a LOOOOONG history with the FPS community. My life, however, has changed where gamings place in my life is not what it was. Pissing the amount of my life that I used to put into gaming is not anything I'd be ok with today. And there is no circumstance where an MMO makes sense for me...then or now. Diablo 1 & 2 were great as you could throw out a return to town portal...save...and go do what you need to do.
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Old 06-25-2008, 05:54 AM   #25
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Wouldn't a Diablo MMO be... exactly the same as Diablo II without the "Create a Game" thing? Who's to say you couldn't town portal back to town and exit in an MMO?
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Old 06-25-2008, 06:10 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squeek.
Wouldn't a Diablo MMO be... exactly the same as Diablo II without the "Create a Game" thing? Who's to say you couldn't town portal back to town and exit in an MMO?
It seems to me that with few exceptions MMO's involve monthly subscription fees. Also, I NEVER played D1, D2 or LOD online. It holds no interest to me. Give me a nice single player game I can zip in and out of as I feel like it and I'm happy. Put it on the DS...even better!
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Old 06-25-2008, 06:44 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by Innoc
And there is no circumstance where an MMO makes sense for me...then or now. Diablo 1 & 2 were great as you could throw out a return to town portal...save...and go do what you need to do.
Yeah, you must understand that when I read this I am puzzled because every MMO has this.
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Old 06-25-2008, 06:47 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Credge
Yeah, you must understand that when I read this I am puzzled because every MMO has this.
Have fun with it. Seriously. But if it goes MMO I will never see it.
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Old 06-25-2008, 12:38 PM   #29
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The problems with MMOs is that they are NOT as much games as an addiction/life-style. People who play WoW, ONLY play WoW and LOTS AND LOTS of it.

The chance of me picking up Diablo 3 would be slim since I never played the other 2 much, but there is no way in hell I'm getting an MMO.
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Old 06-25-2008, 01:04 PM   #30
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I just hope D3 is gonna' be improved graphics, weapons, features, locations, and all that good stuff and not an actual MMO.

I have faith in you bliz-, never mind that, just get this game right, please.
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Old 06-25-2008, 03:10 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooga
The problems with MMOs is that they are NOT as much games as an addiction/life-style. People who play WoW, ONLY play WoW and LOTS AND LOTS of it.

The chance of me picking up Diablo 3 would be slim since I never played the other 2 much, but there is no way in hell I'm getting an MMO.
I play WoW, the current game I play the most is DoD:S, and I've hardly played at all this week.

Yay generalizations!
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Old 06-25-2008, 03:41 PM   #32
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Indeed, I leveled up to 70 on one of my chars whilst still leaguing for TFC every week with practices every other day and still going out a fair amount of time.

But then, I am a student... and I was on summer holidays at the time (iirc).

Yay free time!


Might have to reinstall D2. I can barely remember how it plays. And can someone explain to me what the difference will be if D3 is an MMO rather than whatever it was before?
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Old 06-25-2008, 03:49 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Innoc
Diablo 1 & 2 were great as you could throw out a return to town portal...save...and go do what you need to do.
THIS.

This is what I hope they don't fuck up.

No 1 hour Hearthstone cooldown bullshit. D2 was all about the Town Portal. It was an item you got from level fucking one and used it until level fucking ninety-nine.

It might make PvP suck if someone can just run away via town portal though. Diablo II you could always just kill someone so damn fast they don't have time to click it.
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Old 06-25-2008, 05:38 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmellyCat
Indeed, I leveled up to 70 on one of my chars whilst still leaguing for TFC every week with practices every other day and still going out a fair amount of time.

But then, I am a student... and I was on summer holidays at the time (iirc).

Yay free time!


Might have to reinstall D2. I can barely remember how it plays. And can someone explain to me what the difference will be if D3 is an MMO rather than whatever it was before?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ihmhi
THIS.

This is what I hope they don't fuck up.

No 1 hour Hearthstone cooldown bullshit. D2 was all about the Town Portal. It was an item you got from level fucking one and used it until level fucking ninety-nine.

It might make PvP suck if someone can just run away via town portal though. Diablo II you could always just kill someone so damn fast they don't have time to click it.
Yes that's a big difference. But I would have to say the biggest difference is the fact that D1 and D2 both ended, yes there was an expansion for D2 but it ended as well. The game's had set starts and set finishes. A feeling of accomplishment is gained once you beat the final bad guy.

MMO's don't end... ever. New expansions and releases pushes you to strive for better equipment. Once a guild has finished beating the final guy the new expansion is already well on it's way of being released. So those top players don't get bored and quit.

Current diablos end, and you just repeat the exact same content just stronger creatures. MMO's don't end and end game can never be completed by yourself. Diablo end games can be, infact in D2 it was easier by yourself because creatures were tougher with multiple people in the same game.
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Old 06-25-2008, 06:02 PM   #35
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I think regardless I'd pick up D3 no matter what it is, mostly 'cause 1 and 2 were like... phases of my life. But as to whether or not I'd pay for it...
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Old 06-25-2008, 08:10 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammock
Yes that's a big difference. But I would have to say the biggest difference is the fact that D1 and D2 both ended, yes there was an expansion for D2 but it ended as well. The game's had set starts and set finishes. A feeling of accomplishment is gained once you beat the final bad guy.

TFC Leagues's don't end... ever. New maps and ladders pushes you to strive for better ranking. Once a guild has finished beating the final guy the new ladder is already well on it's way of being released. So those top players don't get bored and quit.

Current diablos end, and you just repeat the exact same content just stronger creatures. TFC Leaguess don't end and end game can never be completed by yourself. Diablo end games can be, infact in D2 it was easier by yourself because creatures were tougher with multiple people in the same game.
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Old 06-25-2008, 09:50 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by zSilver_Fox
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Nice analogy but it's not quite the same deal. FPS's you're competing directly against other players, but in MMO's (even on PvP servers) you're still playing against the "environment". You're playing on the game's terms not "people's terms".

For example, in leagues there's an established date and time for when to log in perform the function planned, and then log out. Repeat as howmany times as you wish.

Compared to camping the final bad guy in Everquest for the cleric epic weapon, that spawned once every 2 weeks randomly. Camping him in shifts 24/7, getting phone calls at 5am to come kill the tough creatures there that spawned once every 10 hours or so. Only to finally have the bad guy spawn and in the middle of the fight have Lord Nagafen spawn on top of you, which do to poor programming and foresight was changed so he would instantly banish everyone over level 52 outside the zone. So the cleric spends another 3 weeks doing his quest and 2 weeks camping the final guy again.

And that's just for 1 cleric! try repeating that 12 times to fully populate your guild clerics with their epic, all for the simple casting of manaless ressurections (a requirement for any end game raids).
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Old 06-25-2008, 11:03 PM   #38
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Sorry. Unless you've only played WoW, if you play on a PVP server you are competing against players constantly so you can then compete against the environment. You fight for your right to hunt somewhere.

The hearth thing, again, is a poor example. /quit, /camp, /log, /exit... all of these exist for a reason. Find a corner to log. It's fairly simple. One of my characters in AoC is walking his way through a dungeon by his lonely lonesome and I'm taking my time with it.

There's absolutely no reason why you can't. The stigma that "oh man, I can't hearth out for another hour so I have to play for another hour" is bogus. If that is how you feel then I'd feel sorry for you grinding away at Mephisto for your Lightsaber.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammock
Compared to camping the final bad guy in Everquest
Been there. Seen my cousins do it. Was on the same server where the guild was disbanded and banned because they killed The Sleeper before he was actually finished (just a human model).

Epic weapons where bogus and didn't last very long in terms of power. It was an absolute waste to get them and the majority of people doing high level content realized this. The only weapons worth getting where the rogue dagger and the warrior 2hander/dual wieldable... and those could be finished in a week of playing if you played for 2 hours a day.

The truth is, a lot of people were fairly terrible at EQ. Many thought they required a full group to even enter dungeons when all it would actually take is a smart healer and a smart tank, or, a monk and a rogue, or, any other duo/trio of players. All that time spent playing EQ was generally because you, or the people you played with, or the people you grouped with, where generally bad.

This is why WoW is so big.
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Old 06-25-2008, 11:22 PM   #39
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Sorry. Unless you've only played WoW, if you play on a PVP server you are competing against players constantly so you can then compete against the environment. You fight for your right to hunt somewhere.

The hearth thing, again, is a poor example. /quit, /camp, /log, /exit... all of these exist for a reason. Find a corner to log. It's fairly simple. One of my characters in AoC is walking his way through a dungeon by his lonely lonesome and I'm taking my time with it.

There's absolutely no reason why you can't. The stigma that "oh man, I can't hearth out for another hour so I have to play for another hour" is bogus. If that is how you feel then I'd feel sorry for you grinding away at Mephisto for your Lightsaber.


Been there. Seen my cousins do it. Was on the same server where the guild was disbanded and banned because they killed The Sleeper before he was actually finished (just a human model).

Epic weapons where bogus and didn't last very long in terms of power. It was an absolute waste to get them and the majority of people doing high level content realized this. The only weapons worth getting where the rogue dagger and the warrior 2hander/dual wieldable... and those could be finished in a week of playing if you played for 2 hours a day.

The truth is, a lot of people were fairly terrible at EQ. Many thought they required a full group to even enter dungeons when all it would actually take is a smart healer and a smart tank, or, a monk and a rogue, or, any other duo/trio of players. All that time spent playing EQ was generally because you, or the people you played with, or the people you grouped with, where generally bad.

This is why WoW is so big.
I'm not gonna lie, Wow has a shitload of terrible players.

Some elements i want them to remove from Diablo 3 is the fact that you can grind the shit of a boss for an hour and get 90 uniques.

I like to feel rewarded when i get something :P unlike Diablo 2, with some good knowledge of the game you get be rich out of your ass in about a week.
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Old 06-25-2008, 11:28 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Credge
Sorry. Unless you've only played WoW, if you play on a PVP server you are competing against players constantly so you can then compete against the environment. You fight for your right to hunt somewhere.

The hearth thing, again, is a poor example. /quit, /camp, /log, /exit... all of these exist for a reason. Find a corner to log. It's fairly simple. One of my characters in AoC is walking his way through a dungeon by his lonely lonesome and I'm taking my time with it.

There's absolutely no reason why you can't. The stigma that "oh man, I can't hearth out for another hour so I have to play for another hour" is bogus. If that is how you feel then I'd feel sorry for you grinding away at Mephisto for your Lightsaber.



Been there. Seen my cousins do it. Was on the same server where the guild was disbanded and banned because they killed The Sleeper before he was actually finished (just a human model).

Epic weapons where bogus and didn't last very long in terms of power. It was an absolute waste to get them and the majority of people doing high level content realized this. The only weapons worth getting where the rogue dagger and the warrior 2hander/dual wieldable... and those could be finished in a week of playing if you played for 2 hours a day.

The truth is, a lot of people were fairly terrible at EQ. Many thought they required a full group to even enter dungeons when all it would actually take is a smart healer and a smart tank, or, a monk and a rogue, or, any other duo/trio of players. All that time spent playing EQ was generally because you, or the people you played with, or the people you grouped with, where generally bad.

This is why WoW is so big.
You obviously played very little everquest and watched even less. The warrior epic weapon was instantly obsolete come Velious, was ranked one of the most useless epics around. One of the coolest looking especially when it was 2 lightsabres. The rogue epic was usefull for a long time and was incredibley easy to get as opposed other epic's like the enchanter's and clerics.

That said the two most valued epics were the enchanters and the cleric. Speed buff and free rez. The absolute most usefull tool on a raid espeically after a whipeout.

And you miss quoted me (thanks for reading the whole sentence).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammock
Compared to camping the final bad guy in Everquest for the cleric epic weapon
The sleeper wasn't the end game either. It was velious for crying out loud. It was just one event that when finished once on a server was never doable again. So the 3 guardians would be farmed by the top guild until they outfitted all their warriors with those awesome weapons, and then killed the 4th guardian to kill the sleeper and prevent anyone else from getting it.

The guild on our server that did the sleeper did it their first try was easier than the guardians themselves.

Planes of power had their own end game guys, by eventually killing the gods themselves, then came the next expansion's end game. Man the sleeper in the grand scheme of things could be considered early game almost.

I repeat... there is no "Final" boss in MMO's. And WoW became bigger than EQ because it is incredibley easy. Hell my dad had a 50+ character in less than a year in that game, and it never exceeded level 54 in EQ. WoW is to EQ as TF2 is to TFC. Simpler and dumbed down, and no sense of loss.

You think waiting for your corpse to respawn at a certain place after a given time sucks? Try dying enough times to loose 3 levels on a fucked up Vox raid, because there was no such thing as corpses respawning somewhere.
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